Comments on: Havurot: a parallel for Christians?

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By: Derek

Derek — Tue, 01 Aug 2006 14:42:28 +0000

The resistance comes from size envy. There is a drive, particularly in the administrative culture of the denomination itself, to view small lay-led fellowships as being less valuable and not as “real churches” in the sense that a large church with paid staff is “real”. Small lay-led churches tend to be more ephemeral than large churches with paid staff, and thus the economic incentive for denominational culture to favor large churches with paid staff.

Quakers can not technically be said to be lay led, since every adult Quaker is a minister. Among Quakers the laity is abolished. Functions in Quaker meetings are carried out by committees, elders, and specialized ministers (pastors, RE directors, etc.). There is a division among Quaker denominations about whether ministers can ever be paid for their service. Most Quakers in Friends General Conference say no, because this creates a hireling ministry with related corruption. In Friends United Meeting the answer is more often yes, because paid ministry frees persons from some amount of secular labor, allowing for more substantial and specialized service to the congregation.

By: Demas

Demas — Tue, 01 Aug 2006 01:03:07 +0000

“present UU practice looks down on such small lay-led communities”

I find this interesting. As I understand it, UU doesn’t have a sacramental focus - no eucharist like the Anglicans have (do UU churches baptise?). So where does the resistance to lay-led services come from? The other religious society which rejects outward sacraments which comes to mind is of course the Quakers - and they are entirely lay-led!

By: Derek

Derek — Mon, 31 Jul 2006 12:32:10 +0000

I think what you are describing is part of what was attempted in the Unitarian Fellowship Movement. But fellowship began to be viewed as half-baked church, and present UU practice looks down on such small lay-led communities.

By: Scott Wells

Scott Wells — Sat, 29 Jul 2006 05:22:14 +0000

Perhaps, but Jewish practice is not what I’d call an easy stream of uniformity. Yet they’ve worked on it and found some workable options. Thus the pluralism approaches I mention but didn’t link. Perhaps tomorrow.

By: Michelle Murrain

Michelle Murrain — Sat, 29 Jul 2006 04:47:16 +0000

Well, one of the big problems about Christianity has been the emphasis on belief, and not practice. I think that would tend to inhibit things like havurot from happening. Perhaps that is what the emerging churches are trying for, but I’m not sure. I’d join one too.